ForestBoard

Candlewhisper Archive wrote:

I missed the eclipse, as I was deep underground, taking advantage of positions celestial and terrestrial to invoke the Seven Sacred Names of the Gods Beyond the Angles, by sacrificing forty-two virgin bullfrogs to the One Whose Trousers Doth Invert In Autumn.

Nothing to do with the eclipse, of course, I just do this every Monday.

I knew modern medicine was nothing but pretense and superstition.

If you ever have the chance to see 100% totality, it's more than worth it. I saw the one today and the one in 2017. It truly just feels out of this world. We were worried about cloud coverage, but as soon as totality started it actually dissipated pretty substantially. The sky turned twilight, the street lights came on, the temperature dropped, the frogs croaked, and a far-off wolf howled--either that or it was some drunk howling down the street, but a magical time all the same. And I can tell you no picture I've ever seen does it justice compared to when you're staring it down with your own eyes. Pictures distort and saturate the corona. The real thing is so crisp it's like a vivid lucid dream. It's something you never forget. If you're in the US, don't wait twenty years for the next one. Go abroad and seek it out; definitely worth it!

Kawastyselir wrote:

If you ever have the chance to see 100% totality, it's more than worth it. I saw the one today and the one in 2017. It truly just feels out of this world. We were worried about cloud coverage, but as soon as totality started it actually dissipated pretty substantially. The sky turned twilight, the street lights came on, the temperature dropped, the frogs croaked, and a far-off wolf howled--either that or it was some drunk howling down the street, but a magical time all the same. And I can tell you no picture I've ever seen does it justice compared to when you're staring it down with your own eyes. Pictures distort and saturate the corona. The real thing is so crisp it's like a vivid lucid dream. It's something you never forget. If you're in the US, don't wait twenty years for the next one. Go abroad and seek it out; definitely worth it!

I realize I'm double-posting, but I hope given the size and context of the above post you all can forgive me. I ended up only witnessing the 95% eclipse from my home. I admit I'm not entirely sure it was the right decision; I think my mother wanted to see the comet and the planets as well. I really mostly wanted to go for her, so it was ultimately her decision, but if we're not willing to drive two hours up state for fear of it being too crowded (spoke with family up there, it indeed was pretty dang packed in his small town), I suspect it'll be hard to convince her to go to a total eclipse elsewhere in the world in several years lol. But we'll see.

I do kind of hope I can see the total eclipse one day, but it's unfortunately way, way down on my bucket list. The number of things I wish to achieve and do is beyond extensive. The number of tangible things I could do, that I really want to do (which this is not part of) alone is too long for me to practically achieve though, rn, given I'm afraid NS and MoFA is about the only thing that I've had drive for in half a year. Fortunately it doesn't require as much brain power as my other obsessions; puzzlemaking [inc. sudokus], languagemaking and worldbuilding, getting myself to read a ton and fast, college [including learning a language], chess-when-I-feel-unwell-for-some-reason, musicmaking, issue writing, WA drafting, RPing, pursuing any actual career or long-term life prospects, etc. all require a ton of energy I just don't always have and certainly haven't had recently. (Hence why I haven't done any of them for half a year.)

I'm praying I'm just eating too much dairy and suffering from calcium overdose, along with maybe too much sleep and not enough movement in the morning/throughout the day. Felt better for a week there... but I'm still concerned by the fact that I'm not the only one still going through this weird sleep patch. But anyway, I still got to enjoy a short walk in nice if suddenly breezy weather with my mom and see the sun mostly covered with funny glasses, so it was still a good day. :')

Jutsa wrote:

-snip-

I'll admit, for most of this read I kept asking myself "If we are neutral, why do we really care whether they are raiders or not?" One of the reasons I decided to come here was for the non-R/D community, and I don't see a huge reason for us, on a surface level, to limit ourselves with establishing ties with a region which has a rich culture and similarly tight-knit community. I'm also new here still, so maybe there's nuance I'm missing in terms of establishing raider relationships broadly.

Them participating in toppling Europe I could see as a potential issue. Again, I'm new and don't know the extent of our relationship to Europe, but the interactions I've had with those from the region have been genuine, thought-provoking, and unique. This is not a relationship I would wish to sour, and unless they've shown remorse and then taken action to earn forgiveness, I would not risk one relationship, which is one (theoretically) proven by time, for this one. If they have taken those steps, then everything else seems in good order, but attacking one who we have such a strong relationship with is pretty significant in my eyes.

I've been pushing in favor of this pretty hard behind the scenes, so I think it's only proper that I make my position on this known and why I can, even in light of Astoria's participation in the raid on Europe, find myself in support of opening relations between our regions.

For a bit of context, this all started with my first campaign post, wherein I mentioned Astoria and how I liked the vibes of that region. Rosa happened to see that and decided to reach out, wishing me well in my election. It was from there that I thought it would be reasonable to take the opportunity and see if there was interest in a possible embassy, so we began talking through telegrams on what this relationship would mean for our regions and how we might move forward with this. This led to our roundtable discussion between some of our government members, where we discussed Forest's gameplay alignment, the raid on Europe and Astoria's gameplay alignment, and our respective region's cultures among other things.

Since that initial discussion with Rosa about one month ago now I have been active in Astoria's regional Discord server, where most of their activity takes place, to see the community for myself and determine whether I thought they would be a good fit for our region. In there I have seen a vibrant, inclusive, and active community, which has placed a great emphasis on their culture, governance, and roleplay. Even despite their youth, they have grown and matured quickly into arguably one of the most recognizable UCRs of the last year if the recent Gameplay Awards is anything to go by.

In a pragmatic or utilitarian sense I think there is a lot to be gained from having relations with Astoria. Their active community has a great focus on events, and I believe that would contribute positively to our own culture. Likewise, I believe many of them would have great interest in participating in the events we hold. Their positive, open, and inclusive community is also a great plus to me; I value a community with a welcoming culture like that, and I believe that welcoming culture would contribute positively to our own similarly welcoming culture.

I also strongly appreciate their dedication to anti-fascism on this site. I first learned of Astoria through one of their anti-fascist operations, and I, being a professional forum lurker, had kept an eye on them since then to see how far they would go. It is with great honor that I say they have continued their dedication to the anti-fascist cause greatly and show no signs of stopping anytime soon. Rosa in particular seems to be, at least in my eyes, the current leader of the anti-fascist movement on this site, having spearheaded or contributed to many of the anti-fascist operations of the last year. There are also a great number of other people dedicated to anti-fascism through military gameplay in their community, including but not limited to IMPC who you may remember briefly took a vacation in our region and joined us for NDay. I have a significant amount of respect for the people that have put themselves at the forefront of stomping out fascism, and I would be lying if I said this wasn't one of the biggest reasons that I would personally want to build these relations between our regions.

While they are in a sense a raider region, that is not all they are, and I have seem Astoria described by some of their government as "a Roleplay region with a military." I have also seen a fair number of their members, Roleplayer or otherwise, talk about how they are not interested in being a part of the Astorian Radiant Cavalry (ARC). That is to say this community is not wholly raider, and I don't think that us opening relations with them should be a reflection that "Forest likes raiders/raiding now" or something like that. We are a neutral region, being neither raider nor defender, and we will continue to be that way. Us opening relations is not us condoning their raids, but wanting to connect our similar communities and positively contribute to each other's cultures.

Europe is definitely the main sore spot in this discussion, and it would be the only thing that could keep me from considering this proposal positively. All that I can say to that, with no disrespect to Europe and our ex-European Forestians, is that in my eyes all of the pros to having these relations with Astoria greatly outweigh any cons. I hope that, should we pursue relations with Astoria, that this would not irreparably hurt our relations with Europe. I value their community, their culture, and their involvement with us, and I would not want to see that change. I hope that we will be able to continue having strong positive relations with Europe while fostering a growing relationship with Astoria, and that our relations with either would not impede on each other.

Jutsa wrote:

snap

I support this.

An embassy/formal relationships with a raider region? FK expressing their support for those who raided Europe?

Are you joking?

All this “good raiders” thing is just demagogy. Forest brand is known as us preferring to stand out from R/D mechanics, as well as condemning destruction raiders bring. We may have former and active raiders residing here (I won’t comment on that right now), but to have an official relationship with an R/D region sounds extremely worrisome and cringe, to that extent.

We felt bad for Europe as they got raided, we discussed possible measures to secure our board and region should we have any threat after this grand event, and now it’s not even much time passed and the new cabinet lost their memory.

I feel like Forest is losing its neutrality with the second embassy in a row that highlights official regional alignment. Now it’s not so clear and oblivious to some, but the trend is negative.

If we come to an embassy poll, it would define whether I’ll keep residing in Forest or moving out until Zerphen’s term ends, and probably, until a raider embassy is taken down (if another administration won’t try to cancel it asap). It’s hilarious how back in my term Zerphen unfairly blamed me for going against Forest’s values and now openly supports this thing, which, in my eyes, are literal betrayal of what we stood for and against of past years. One simple embassy case could be a bright signal of something we might not want to be. No-embassy formal ties to raiders is just dirt on our reputation.

Upd: and can we stop using NDay as an excuse for embassies and similar stuff already, please?

Upd2: Whatever you put it like, Zerphen, it already is insulting Europe as our established friend who just suffered from the raid, and me personally who comes from Europe. This move indicates disrespect to our existing embassies and devalues the entire perks of having them. I’m very mad at this situation, as you all can see.

Jutsa wrote:

They are also primarily what one may call "fash-bashers", meaning they primarily raid fascist regions, prioritizing their part in Antifa over Raider Unity operations.

It is inconsistent to say that they are fash-bashers who raid for virtuous reasons when it is the case that they target regular regions, like Europe, as well. Big exception there. I think it would be more accurate to say that they are just regular raiders.

Isbjorn Maerenne Bava Paerani wrote:

It is inconsistent to say that they are fash-bashers who raid for virtuous reasons when it is the case that they target regular regions, like Europe, as well. Big exception there. I think it would be more accurate to say that they are just regular raiders.

In this context I wouldn’t call Europe just a regular region. First, it’s one of the largest regions in game, and second, it’s one of the largest anti-fascist regions in game. They also have a very strong stance against the fash.

Einswenn wrote:

-snip-

Understandably, there will be opposition to this decision. Zerphen and I (Rosartemis) have extensively discussed the matter, carefully weighing its pros and cons. Naturally, the first point we addressed in our discussion was Astoria's alignment with raiders.

2.2 Forest is neither a raider region, nor is it a defender region. Nations in Forest are expected to not undertake any sort of inter-regional ‘military’ action (raiding or defending). Forest will not act as a staging ground for military operation.

If Forest's commitment to pacifism is to be upheld, then it should not serve as a reason to prohibit relations with a raider region, especially if it does not exempt defenders either.

Let's dive into the crux of the matter - our involvement in the raid on Europe. It's perfectly understandable, and I empathize with Forest's sentiment, valuing Europe as a cherished friend. However, I will clarify that our participation in Europe's insurrection wasn't intended as a slight against Forest's or any of its members dignity. Opening relations with Astoria while maintaining your esteemed friendship with Europe need not be seen as conflicting objectives. I firmly believe that our actions won't tarnish Europe's perception of Forest in any way. Moreover, if necessary, I'm prepared to engage in dialogue with Imperium Anglorum to mend any past misunderstandings. Astoria's aim is simply to foster a cultural friendship with Forest, nothing more. We hold utmost respect for Forest's commitment to neutrality.

Isbjorn Maerenne Bava Paerani wrote:

It is inconsistent to say that they are fash-bashers who raid for virtuous reasons when it is the case that they target regular regions, like Europe, as well. Big exception there. I think it would be more accurate to say that they are just regular raiders.

To clarify, while we identify as raiders, fash-bashing operates on a completely different premise from traditional R/D activities. I would argue that fash-bashing transcends the typical raider or defender dichotomy. Our motivations for targeting fascist regions are as virtuous as we claim them to be, and we have consistently upheld this principle. Personally, I spearheaded the fash-bashing of Sacrumterra in Operation Eden, collaborating with defenders to dismantle the former fourth-largest fascist region. I also directed fash-bashes on Brebina, resulting in the destruction of two other fascist regions, namely the Coalition of NS Fascists and Pentarchia. Furthermore, I contributed to the most recent fash-bash led by our allies from Kantrias, participating in the invasion of Ardenia. It is not uncommon for raiders to participate in or even direct fash-bashes. While we do take credit for these actions, they are not the result of unregulated raiding but rather a commitment to denying fascists a platform on this site. Fash-bashing is both an IC endeavor, akin to how participating militaries express their R/D alignment, and an OOC endeavor, driven not by a desire for geopolitical advantage or victory, but by the noble aim of combating fascist ideologies that have proliferated on NationStates. Therefore, I must say that the view characterizing our involvement in fash-bashing as purely raider activity is inaccurate.

EDIT: Indeed, there are regions that exclusively engage in fash-bashing, such as The Red Fleet (the military of your friends in The Leftist Assembly), MT Army, and The Communist Bloc's PRAF. However, the participation of regions in both R/D activities and fash-bashing does not categorize them simply as "regular raiders". Numerous regions, whether raider or defender, unite in this goal. Personally, I collaborate with members of The Order of the Grey Wardens to identify problematic regions and players, safeguarding the average native from OOC threats. Astoria has cooperated with The East Pacific and the aforementioned regions towards these objectives, without regard for gameplay alignment. Fash-bashing is not exclusive to raiding, it is a cause shared by every region in the GP community, irrespective of in-character alignment.

The March of Time wrote:

2.2 Forest is neither a raider region, nor is it a defender region. Nations in Forest are expected to not undertake any sort of inter-regional ‘military’ action (raiding or defending). Forest will not act as a staging ground for military operation.

If Forest's commitment to pacifism is to be upheld, then it should not serve as a reason to prohibit relations with a raider region, especially if it does not exempt defenders either.

An expected constitution manipulation. But neither does this article prohibit from being against raiders or be against starting new ties with them. Being pacifist is also being against violence and destruction, and these two words directly relate to raiders. It’s naturally clear some (or, I hope, many) of us will advocate against raiders.

You put so many words in your post and yet you remain a raider region who attacked our friends. It doesn’t matter if you didn’t intend to offend us by this action; and yes we followed our constitution and didn’t participate in it; neither in raid nor in defence. It doesn’t mean we are automatically ok with what you did and do.

It's a no for me. We have really complex foreign affairs processes as it is. We really don't need a whole additional layer of "formal diplomatic relations." There's already a fully developed system for that - it's called embassies. I'd like to see this nipped in the bud before the bureaucratic complexity really gets out of hand.

Secondly, a region that took part in a raid on an ally? Why is this even a question?

Einswenn wrote:

An expected constitution manipulation. But neither does this article prohibit from being against raiders or be against starting new ties with them. Being pacifist is also being against violence and destruction, and these two words directly relate to raiders. It’s naturally clear some (or, I hope, many) of us will advocate against raiders.

You put so many words in your post and yet you remain a raider region who attacked our friends. It doesn’t matter if you didn’t intend to offend us by this action; and yes we followed our constitution and didn’t participate in it; neither in raid nor in defence. It doesn’t mean we are automatically ok with what you did and do.

It is not a manipulation of the constitution; I am simply referencing the words stated within it. While the constitution may not explicitly prohibit opposition to raiders or the establishment of ties with them, it does not mandate refraining from such actions either. It presents a significant obstacle, but not one that cannot be overcome.

As I mentioned earlier, you are entitled to take offense at our actions in Europe, and it is understandable if you are not comfortable with them. However, allowing our friendship to develop would not jeopardize Forest's reputation or its existing relationships with Europe. Moreover, it would not undermine Forest's commitment to pacifism. From my understanding, Forest's pacifism manifests in two ways: neutrality in R/D conflicts and a relaxed stance on the raider/defender conflict, as well as a general opposition to raiding. Personally, I do not interpret anti-raiderism as neutrality, but ultimately, it is open to your interpretation. Once again, I am prepared to engage in discussions with Imperium Anglorum if deemed necessary.

A raider explaining why they’re good? Yeah. What else would they say. I’ll just leave it with this quote:

Uan aa Boa wrote:

Why is this even a question?

I should preface this by saying that I was involved in behind the scenes discussions to bring this to vote, but have remained broadly against it throughout. Astoria are a raider region, who raided one of our closest allies and while there have been a lot of excuses or "it wasn't that bad because" from their side, it still happened, and it still affected a region we have close ties with and which many of our most active members came here from. I don't believe the pacifism here is the important bit, although Astoria seems to be a more explicit raider region than our other R/D embassies, more that I don't want to endanger any of our existing relationships with this.

Additionally, I just don't see any reasons for this embassy or "formal diplomatic relationship" to exist. Most of our embassies are primarily based around crossposting on each other's RMBs and contributing to the discussion. Astoria's RMB is short and what we would consider spammy, but for a spammy region it doesn't even move as fast as some. Embassies have been destroyed at vote for less in the past. This is arguably less important because of the lack of an onsite embassy, but I don't see any reason to maintain these relationships without an embassy, which on a gameplay level enables possibly the core interaction between Forest and its embassies. These "formal diplomatic relationships" feel as though we would have 2 or 3 people on each other's discords, maybe invite them to a few things and then forget about them before the next term.

I don't see any good reasons to do this, and I see a lot of reasons against having another raider embassy, "fash basher" or regular raider.

EDIT: I'm also slightly skeptical of using this system to evade the normal constitutional process of forming embassies. This is probably an easy clarification, but I feel the "non-binding opinion poll" should be binding, and follow the 2/3rd majority rule found in official embassy polls. This has the potential to upset a lot of people in Forest and in our allies, and I would like clearer wording on the nature of this vote.

Garbelia wrote:

Additionally, I just don't see any reasons for this embassy or "formal diplomatic relationship" to exist. Most of our embassies are primarily based around crossposting on each other's RMBs and contributing to the discussion. Astoria's RMB is short and what we would consider spammy, but for a spammy region it doesn't even move as fast as some. Embassies have been destroyed at vote for less in the past. This is arguably less important because of the lack of an onsite embassy, but I don't see any reason to maintain these relationships without an embassy, which on a gameplay level enables possibly the core interaction between Forest and its embassies. These "formal diplomatic relationships" feel as though we would have 2 or 3 people on each other's discords, maybe invite them to a few things and then forget about them before the next term.

To cite Jutsa's point in the opening post:

Jutsa wrote:

We've also been assured that if there are any concerns with Astoria's RMB, which maintains players who are younger and on the more active side, most of their proper activity is carried out off-site. They respect our RMB posting culture and will swiftly punish players in their own region who cause problems in ours, something that would be promptly communicated to their members.

This will all be strictly enforced, to reiterate we have plenty of active members on our Discord that would enjoy Forest's RMB posting culture and would frequently engage in it given the chance, I personally would as well.

I'm going to throw my ill-informed opinion into the mix. I don't pay any attention to raider stuff because I find it incredibly tedious. However, I do remember that Forest got raided several years ago. If I'm remembering correctly, we permanently lost a lot of our records that way. That was discouraging and not at all fun.

I followed that link to an RMB discussion about the raid on Europe, and it looked to me like there were some blatantly disingenuous attempts at justifying it ("the founder is uninvolved, so we were actually helping!").

Regarding the mentions of Antifa, I don't believe that any organization that uses anonymous, lawless violence to achieve its ends is doing the world any favors - so that's not a positive for me.

Jutsa, I really appreciate the time and effort you've put into thinking through this proposal and presenting it to us. I will likely either abstain or vote no...although, as I mentioned, my opinion about the raiding community is ill-informed so I'm open to being corrected.

Esterild wrote:

I'm going to throw my ill-informed opinion into the mix. I don't pay any attention to raider stuff because I find it incredibly tedious. However, I do remember that Forest got raided several years ago. If I'm remembering correctly, we permanently lost a lot of our records that way. That was discouraging and not at all fun.

Regarding this matter, I want to clarify that I wasn't present when it occurred, as I only joined the GP community in August of 2023. This piece of history wasn't raised during the roundtable discussion. However, I also want to address the notion of "losing records" from a raid, which seems mechanically implausible to me. Unless we define "losing records" differently, such as permanently losing dispatches or regional assets, which isn't feasible since everything on NationStates is either player-based or archived by external websites dedicated to preserving such data. Additionally, it's worth noting that Forest is invulnerable to raids, as there is nothing here that can be meaningfully destroyed by an external invasion, unlike an internal one. Therefore, I highly doubt Ruinenlust would suddenly decide to ban everyone from the region.

Esterild wrote:

Regarding the mentions of Antifa, I don't believe that any organization that uses anonymous, lawless violence to achieve its ends is doing the world any favors - so that's not a positive for me

To clarify, the NS Antifa is not affiliated with the ANTIFA movement. The Antifa group on NationStates is a diverse coalition of regions united in the common goal of combating fascism within the NationStates community. Currently, Antifa is overseen by The Pacific, an unaligned region. You can find a list of member regions, including Astoria, alongside other militaries, regardless of their GP alignment here:

It's important to note that the real-world ANTIFA is a movement, not an organization. There is often misinformation circulating, claiming that ANTIFA is an organized dissent group, which is false. ANTIFA is an international anti-fascist movement without leaders or hierarchy, solely dedicated to opposing fascism. While delving into the specifics of the real-world ANTIFA may not be directly relevant here, I wanted to clarify this point due to the misinformation surrounding its goals and principles :)

Esterild wrote:

However, I do remember that Forest got raided several years ago. If I'm remembering correctly, we permanently lost a lot of our records that way. That was discouraging and not at all fun.

I am too new to know this though, but now I’m even more opposed to the entire idea of even discussing this topic, not to mention consideration of moving on further. Raiding is never fun and destruction of communities that were built by invested members is gross and not worthy of any form of respect. I could never understand the uncontrollable desire to ruin fun for others, to sabotage instead of building.

There’s no valid justification for such movements and communities. It doesn’t matter how “rich” their culture is if they’re involved in destructive behaviour. You don’t say “oh such a great painter it is!” if there’s whole spectrum of violence happening along. The same applies here, befriending regions that aim to destroy others annihilates 100% of “pros”.

I don't particularly understand what's going on, but
Why are we trying to ally ourselves with raiders?
ESPECIALLY ones that raided Europe?
Now I admit I may have biases in this conversation, due to the fact I spent the majority of my nation's life so far in that region, and indeed I was forced out due to hyperactivity on the RMB that may have been caused in part by raiders (although the main raiding party came after I left), but that arguably makes my case more valid.

I don't have the whole picture but I have enough of it to understand what happened.

(Sidenote: Why do people even raid? What joy does one get out of destroying a whole community? My home region of Europe never recovered to the full extent of what it was like previously, and it's one of the most powerful regions in the game. Admittedly I haven't checked up in a while, and the last time I checked the discord server everything seemed okay, but I do know that there is a lasting impact on Europe.
A much smaller region could be destroyed utterly, and indeed, many have.)

EDIT: I have discovered that the raiders we wish to start formal relations with may have been the "main raiding party" I described previously.
I was already against the suggestion before, but if they did that...
I was unfortunately not present for most of the event, which meant that I was coming in basically as it was ending, and it was difficult to fully grasp what happened, but what I can grasp is the amount of chaos caused.

Thank god the vote is going the way it is at the time of writing. I don't want something like that to happen to Forest too, and the chance of an alliance with the raiders making such an event occur here easier is just as likely as the chance of it exempting us from future raids.

I second this. To even consider allying with raiders, especially ones that raided a region we are already allied with, and several residents (myself included) have strong ties to, is bonkers. As Einswenn said, raiders and their actions are not worthy of respect. I firmly believe it would go against the nature of this region for us to ally ourselves with a raider region.

Einswenn wrote:

I am too new to know this though, but now I’m even more opposed to the entire idea of even discussing this topic, not to mention consideration of moving on further. Raiding is never fun and destruction of communities that were built by invested members is gross and not worthy of any form of respect. I could never understand the uncontrollable desire to ruin fun for others, to sabotage instead of building.

There’s no valid justification for such movements and communities. It doesn’t matter how “rich” their culture is if they’re involved in destructive behaviour. You don’t say “oh such a great painter it is!” if there’s whole spectrum of violence happening along. The same applies here, befriending regions that aim to destroy others annihilates 100% of “pros”.

I can't help but point out the double standard at play here. Sure, raiding raises valid concerns, but let's not pretend it's a one-sided affair. Shouldn't you hold your allies to the same standards? If you condemn the griefing of communities, why the silence on Solidarity, the former joint frontier of NSLeft, and the frontier largely operated by your long time embassy in The Leftist Assembly? If you brand Astoria for its actions, then shouldn't the same scrutiny apply to Forest's friends, like The Union of Democratic States, 10000 Islands, and The North Pacific, who partook in the raid of Solidarity? How does their involvement differ from Astoria's in Europe?

Opposition without consistency lacks credibility. If you denounce one for this reason, shouldn't you disapprove of all else?

Opposing raids should mean opposing them across the board. The invasion of Solidarity, despite its backing by The Communist Bloc, was a blow to neutral communities and leftist principles alike. As a leftist, I'm disappointed in those who turned a blind eye to the actions of one in the name of some twisted "counter-invasion" logic. If you truly stand by your principles, you should condemn all unjustified raids, regardless of the affiliations involved. After all, your stance is against the destruction of communities as a whole, not just against raiding.

The March of Time wrote:

Regarding this matter, I want to clarify that I wasn't present when it occurred, as I only joined the GP community in August of 2023. This piece of history wasn't raised during the roundtable discussion. However, I also want to address the notion of "losing records" from a raid, which seems mechanically implausible to me. Unless we define "losing records" differently, such as permanently losing dispatches or regional assets, which isn't feasible since everything on NationStates is either player-based or archived by external websites dedicated to preserving such data. Additionally, it's worth noting that Forest is invulnerable to raids, as there is nothing here that can be meaningfully destroyed by an external invasion, unlike an internal one. Therefore, I highly doubt Ruinenlust would suddenly decide to ban everyone from the region.

I looked through our "History" dispatch and found the thing I was remembering:

"In January 2015, raiders began crashing regions whose delegates had very long continuous streaks, for the sole purpose of ending these streaks. First Texas, a region with the second longest serving delegate, was successfully crashed. Shortly afterwards an unsuccessful attempt was made at Ransium and Forest. However, on the 15th of August The Black Hawks finally successfully raided the region ending Ransium’s streak as delegate (having been in the position for 2989 days, one of the top 5 streaks in all of NationStates) and placing the nation of Ayrendrall in his place. The Black Hawks left as quickly as they came however as Errinundera ejected and banned the raiders and Ransium resumed the delegacy."

I seem to remember that they trashed our World Factbook Entry/dispatches/whatever and some of it was unrecoverable, but I didn't pay much attention to the details of what was going on, because it was just annoying and frustrating and there wasn't anything I could do about it anyway.